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	<title>Comments on: Renaming the Game</title>
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		<title>By: prankenstein</title>
		<link>http://brilli.am/writes/2009/04/24/renaming-the-game/comment-page-1/#comment-2254</link>
		<dc:creator>prankenstein</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 29 Jul 2009 08:42:12 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://brilli.am/writes/?p=230#comment-2254</guid>
		<description>How about digital games?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>How about digital games?</p>
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		<title>By: brilli.am/writes &#187; Blog Archive &#187; Renaming the Game II: The Clarifying</title>
		<link>http://brilli.am/writes/2009/04/24/renaming-the-game/comment-page-1/#comment-1223</link>
		<dc:creator>brilli.am/writes &#187; Blog Archive &#187; Renaming the Game II: The Clarifying</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 04 May 2009 15:29:01 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://brilli.am/writes/?p=230#comment-1223</guid>
		<description>[...] the feedback. So much so, that I&#8217;m writing this response! It might be worth reading the first article before this one or else it may not make [...]</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[...] the feedback. So much so, that I&#8217;m writing this response! It might be worth reading the first article before this one or else it may not make [...]</p>
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		<title>By: Tellurian</title>
		<link>http://brilli.am/writes/2009/04/24/renaming-the-game/comment-page-1/#comment-1219</link>
		<dc:creator>Tellurian</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 04 May 2009 08:22:14 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://brilli.am/writes/?p=230#comment-1219</guid>
		<description>There&#039;s the constantly ongoing bitchfight between consoleros and PCgamers wether you&#039;re talking computer- OR videogames, since one term supposedly doesn&#039;t fit the other&#039;s contents. 
Going in the &quot;Movie&quot; direction, the term &quot;Interactive&quot; could be coined there, since that IS the common element of these. 
&quot;Yesterday I watched a movie and played some online interactives.&quot; 
Yeah still sounds a bit like a 70s sci-fi version of today.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>There&#8217;s the constantly ongoing bitchfight between consoleros and PCgamers wether you&#8217;re talking computer- OR videogames, since one term supposedly doesn&#8217;t fit the other&#8217;s contents.<br />
Going in the &#8220;Movie&#8221; direction, the term &#8220;Interactive&#8221; could be coined there, since that IS the common element of these.<br />
&#8220;Yesterday I watched a movie and played some online interactives.&#8221;<br />
Yeah still sounds a bit like a 70s sci-fi version of today.</p>
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		<title>By: Ben Abraham</title>
		<link>http://brilli.am/writes/2009/04/24/renaming-the-game/comment-page-1/#comment-1125</link>
		<dc:creator>Ben Abraham</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 27 Apr 2009 00:39:06 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://brilli.am/writes/?p=230#comment-1125</guid>
		<description>I think that &quot;video game&quot; (or videogame if, like me, you prefer) comes close to describing what they&#039;re usually &quot;put on&quot;, since they&#039;re usually on some sort of video screen.

I also think that the conventions around memory say that something is stored &quot;in memory&quot; rather than on memory derails your argument a bit.

What&#039;s wrong with &#039;Computer Games&#039;? That *is* what they are played/put on, after all - some kind of computer.  In fact, &#039;computer games&#039; used to be my defacto term for video games before I picked up that convention.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I think that &#8220;video game&#8221; (or videogame if, like me, you prefer) comes close to describing what they&#8217;re usually &#8220;put on&#8221;, since they&#8217;re usually on some sort of video screen.</p>
<p>I also think that the conventions around memory say that something is stored &#8220;in memory&#8221; rather than on memory derails your argument a bit.</p>
<p>What&#8217;s wrong with &#8216;Computer Games&#8217;? That *is* what they are played/put on, after all &#8211; some kind of computer.  In fact, &#8216;computer games&#8217; used to be my defacto term for video games before I picked up that convention.</p>
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		<title>By: mad</title>
		<link>http://brilli.am/writes/2009/04/24/renaming-the-game/comment-page-1/#comment-1120</link>
		<dc:creator>mad</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 26 Apr 2009 15:16:54 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://brilli.am/writes/?p=230#comment-1120</guid>
		<description>&#039;Game&#039; is the perfect word though. My argument is that the only reason it seems like an improper term is because the markets, media and even academia, have co-opted the term to suite their needs. To rebel against the word &#039;game&#039; because of how they use it, is to implicitly buy into their worldview.

I sincerely like how you say &quot;Why is a sale the endgame&quot;, because it reminds that this is also a game that we are playing. The rules and goals are fuzzy, it is not necessarily fun, but it is a game, and I find it fascinating as a game.

To allow them to keep the word &#039;game&#039; for their own uses is to lose, and I believe that we should play to win.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>&#8216;Game&#8217; is the perfect word though. My argument is that the only reason it seems like an improper term is because the markets, media and even academia, have co-opted the term to suite their needs. To rebel against the word &#8216;game&#8217; because of how they use it, is to implicitly buy into their worldview.</p>
<p>I sincerely like how you say &#8220;Why is a sale the endgame&#8221;, because it reminds that this is also a game that we are playing. The rules and goals are fuzzy, it is not necessarily fun, but it is a game, and I find it fascinating as a game.</p>
<p>To allow them to keep the word &#8216;game&#8217; for their own uses is to lose, and I believe that we should play to win.</p>
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		<title>By: brilliam</title>
		<link>http://brilli.am/writes/2009/04/24/renaming-the-game/comment-page-1/#comment-1118</link>
		<dc:creator>brilliam</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 26 Apr 2009 14:39:33 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://brilli.am/writes/?p=230#comment-1118</guid>
		<description>Why is a sale the endgame, though? People are making games for free simply because they find the interactive medium more powerful for the type of expression they&#039;re going for. And people are playing them because they crave that. People aren&#039;t prepared to pay for it yet but perhaps someday they might be. The point is, though, that whether or not it&#039;s saleable is beside the point; the sheer fact that a program can be _made_ and people might _use_ it is reason enough to have a proper bit of terminology.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Why is a sale the endgame, though? People are making games for free simply because they find the interactive medium more powerful for the type of expression they&#8217;re going for. And people are playing them because they crave that. People aren&#8217;t prepared to pay for it yet but perhaps someday they might be. The point is, though, that whether or not it&#8217;s saleable is beside the point; the sheer fact that a program can be _made_ and people might _use_ it is reason enough to have a proper bit of terminology.</p>
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		<title>By: mad</title>
		<link>http://brilli.am/writes/2009/04/24/renaming-the-game/comment-page-1/#comment-1107</link>
		<dc:creator>mad</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 26 Apr 2009 00:04:19 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://brilli.am/writes/?p=230#comment-1107</guid>
		<description>Another way to look at this:

That games are associated with fun is more a commercial/entertainment thing, no? It&#039;s not something that is inherent to the medium.

Games of poker, chess, football, war, the heart.... with money, pride, life or love on the line, all games contain anticipation, drama, conflict, hope, tragedy, catharsis. There&#039;s always a context, a history; there are colorful characters, their developments and revelations. To win or lose is simple and pure; but it provides a reason, and a meaning to everything that surrounds it.

Games aren&#039;t supposed to be fun because they are fun, but because that&#039;s what can sell to people who just want to have... fun! Trying to distance oneself from games not because of what they are but how they&#039;re sold is kind of meh.

But yeah, we could probably do with removing the &#039;video&#039; qualifier at the front.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Another way to look at this:</p>
<p>That games are associated with fun is more a commercial/entertainment thing, no? It&#8217;s not something that is inherent to the medium.</p>
<p>Games of poker, chess, football, war, the heart&#8230;. with money, pride, life or love on the line, all games contain anticipation, drama, conflict, hope, tragedy, catharsis. There&#8217;s always a context, a history; there are colorful characters, their developments and revelations. To win or lose is simple and pure; but it provides a reason, and a meaning to everything that surrounds it.</p>
<p>Games aren&#8217;t supposed to be fun because they are fun, but because that&#8217;s what can sell to people who just want to have&#8230; fun! Trying to distance oneself from games not because of what they are but how they&#8217;re sold is kind of meh.</p>
<p>But yeah, we could probably do with removing the &#8216;video&#8217; qualifier at the front.</p>
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		<title>By: Travis</title>
		<link>http://brilli.am/writes/2009/04/24/renaming-the-game/comment-page-1/#comment-1104</link>
		<dc:creator>Travis</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 25 Apr 2009 17:58:23 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://brilli.am/writes/?p=230#comment-1104</guid>
		<description>The problem goes beyond nomenclature.  The medium of which we speak is largely composed of, yes, games.  It is to games that we look when we want to make some kind of critical artistic analysis.

Can a game be art?  Is chess an art?  What about Puerto Rico?  Is good game design an art form - establishing balanced choices and keeping players entertained and stimulated throughout?  What about playing a game - is there art in being a mindboggling Street Fighter expert?  Does that mean polevaulters and gymnasts are artists too?

There is a philosophical distinction between &quot;design&quot; and &quot;art,&quot; one that only became pronounced after classical times.  Building a beautiful chair that is like a minimalistic sculpture is surely art, but building a GOOD chair became delineated from that.  Some would suggest that the gap between them is narrowing again.

Beyond that, should &quot;video games&quot; remain in the arena of gaming, or should there be attempts to move beyond entertainment to a more artistic realm?  As you say, most art is not &quot;fun&quot; in the same sense of the rest of its medium.  I have fun reading a good entertaining story, but when I read Joyce or Faulkner it&#039;s not &quot;fun.&quot;  It&#039;s satisfying, it&#039;s engaging, it&#039;s fulfilling, it&#039;s mind-broadening, but not fun.

But how else can people be motivated to engage in something so interactive?  How else can their interest be gained, especially in terms of a medium so deeply embedded in our minds as a game?  The video game is so closely tied to the engine of industry, and so young, that I don&#039;t foresee it breaking away from being fun - usually mindless, shallow fun - for profit.  Of course, film and books and music are massively profit-based as well.  There exists still a strong current of &quot;art&quot; film and &quot;literature,&quot; at least, which is driven by artistic needs and desires rather than entertainment = money.

I really don&#039;t foresee the imminent success of a game that isn&#039;t &quot;fun&quot; to play, but on the other hand we are seeing some now - the one where you play a grandmother walking through a cemetery, and all you do is walk and wait to potentially die, for example.  Probably not &quot;successful&quot; but it has been published and received news stories from various major websites.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>The problem goes beyond nomenclature.  The medium of which we speak is largely composed of, yes, games.  It is to games that we look when we want to make some kind of critical artistic analysis.</p>
<p>Can a game be art?  Is chess an art?  What about Puerto Rico?  Is good game design an art form &#8211; establishing balanced choices and keeping players entertained and stimulated throughout?  What about playing a game &#8211; is there art in being a mindboggling Street Fighter expert?  Does that mean polevaulters and gymnasts are artists too?</p>
<p>There is a philosophical distinction between &#8220;design&#8221; and &#8220;art,&#8221; one that only became pronounced after classical times.  Building a beautiful chair that is like a minimalistic sculpture is surely art, but building a GOOD chair became delineated from that.  Some would suggest that the gap between them is narrowing again.</p>
<p>Beyond that, should &#8220;video games&#8221; remain in the arena of gaming, or should there be attempts to move beyond entertainment to a more artistic realm?  As you say, most art is not &#8220;fun&#8221; in the same sense of the rest of its medium.  I have fun reading a good entertaining story, but when I read Joyce or Faulkner it&#8217;s not &#8220;fun.&#8221;  It&#8217;s satisfying, it&#8217;s engaging, it&#8217;s fulfilling, it&#8217;s mind-broadening, but not fun.</p>
<p>But how else can people be motivated to engage in something so interactive?  How else can their interest be gained, especially in terms of a medium so deeply embedded in our minds as a game?  The video game is so closely tied to the engine of industry, and so young, that I don&#8217;t foresee it breaking away from being fun &#8211; usually mindless, shallow fun &#8211; for profit.  Of course, film and books and music are massively profit-based as well.  There exists still a strong current of &#8220;art&#8221; film and &#8220;literature,&#8221; at least, which is driven by artistic needs and desires rather than entertainment = money.</p>
<p>I really don&#8217;t foresee the imminent success of a game that isn&#8217;t &#8220;fun&#8221; to play, but on the other hand we are seeing some now &#8211; the one where you play a grandmother walking through a cemetery, and all you do is walk and wait to potentially die, for example.  Probably not &#8220;successful&#8221; but it has been published and received news stories from various major websites.</p>
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		<title>By: Eric J</title>
		<link>http://brilli.am/writes/2009/04/24/renaming-the-game/comment-page-1/#comment-1103</link>
		<dc:creator>Eric J</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 25 Apr 2009 16:32:26 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://brilli.am/writes/?p=230#comment-1103</guid>
		<description>in the middle days of Infocom, they decided that the moniker &quot;interactive fiction&quot; was too clunky to go on, and announced a contest to have it renamed. 

The contest ended without a winner, nobody was able to come up with anything decent.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>in the middle days of Infocom, they decided that the moniker &#8220;interactive fiction&#8221; was too clunky to go on, and announced a contest to have it renamed. </p>
<p>The contest ended without a winner, nobody was able to come up with anything decent.</p>
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		<title>By: teh_red_baron</title>
		<link>http://brilli.am/writes/2009/04/24/renaming-the-game/comment-page-1/#comment-1101</link>
		<dc:creator>teh_red_baron</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 25 Apr 2009 04:24:50 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://brilli.am/writes/?p=230#comment-1101</guid>
		<description>And then there&#039;s &#039;movies&#039;, or &#039;moving pictures&#039;.

I think &#039;videogames&#039; is fine.  It&#039;s inextricable.  All it takes is exposure for people to respect the medium.

But I still like what you&#039;ve attempted here.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>And then there&#8217;s &#8216;movies&#8217;, or &#8216;moving pictures&#8217;.</p>
<p>I think &#8216;videogames&#8217; is fine.  It&#8217;s inextricable.  All it takes is exposure for people to respect the medium.</p>
<p>But I still like what you&#8217;ve attempted here.</p>
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		<title>By: mad</title>
		<link>http://brilli.am/writes/2009/04/24/renaming-the-game/comment-page-1/#comment-1100</link>
		<dc:creator>mad</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 25 Apr 2009 02:03:05 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://brilli.am/writes/?p=230#comment-1100</guid>
		<description>also note:
video games are about graphics
computer games are about numbers
most players don&#039;t care about the other stuff :P</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>also note:<br />
video games are about graphics<br />
computer games are about numbers<br />
most players don&#8217;t care about the other stuff :P</p>
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		<title>By: mad</title>
		<link>http://brilli.am/writes/2009/04/24/renaming-the-game/comment-page-1/#comment-1099</link>
		<dc:creator>mad</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 25 Apr 2009 01:56:44 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://brilli.am/writes/?p=230#comment-1099</guid>
		<description>There is history here; see Chiptunes, 8-bit, 16-bit.

Naming it after the memory makes it feel static, like data. Naming it after the processor makes it dynamic, which is what games are typically all about.

Compare also to processes, executables, etc.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>There is history here; see Chiptunes, 8-bit, 16-bit.</p>
<p>Naming it after the memory makes it feel static, like data. Naming it after the processor makes it dynamic, which is what games are typically all about.</p>
<p>Compare also to processes, executables, etc.</p>
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		<title>By: Matthew Gallant</title>
		<link>http://brilli.am/writes/2009/04/24/renaming-the-game/comment-page-1/#comment-1096</link>
		<dc:creator>Matthew Gallant</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 24 Apr 2009 23:58:03 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://brilli.am/writes/?p=230#comment-1096</guid>
		<description>Of course memory == binary, so that&#039;s another direction you could take.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Of course memory == binary, so that&#8217;s another direction you could take.</p>
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